The Future of Finance Podcast

What 25 Years in Climate Investing Reveals About the Institutional Capital Gap

What does 25 years of dedicated clean energy investing reveal about today's institutional opportunity? In this episode of the Future of Finance podcast, host Georges Dyer speaks with Daniel G. Weiss, Co-Founder and Managing Partner of Angeleno Group — a Los Angeles-based venture and growth equity firm that has led or co-led over $3 billion into clean energy and climate solutions since 2001, with a limited partner base drawn largely from endowments, foundations, and pension funds.
Weiss offers a rigorous, evidence-based perspective on why the investment case for clean energy has fundamentally shifted — and why institutional capital has been slow to reflect that shift. The conversation addresses the structural drivers of return, the scale of the remaining deployment gap, and how both public and private market allocators can reframe their approach to climate-related investment.
Key themes covered in this episode:
- The 80–95% cost reduction across core clean energy technologies and its implications for risk-adjusted returns
- The 25x growth in climate tech venture capital (2013–2023) and the emerging pipeline of institutional-scale growth companies - Why the "concessionary returns" assumption is a market misconception, and how to correct it
- The role of AI and data center load growth in accelerating, and potentially moderating, energy demand
- Grid resilience, renewable procurement software, and smart energy infrastructure as current investment opportunities
- The case for a whole-portfolio approach: public and private markets, across asset classes
- Mission-aligned endowment stewardship at organizations including the World Resources Institute and California Community Foundation Angeleno's most recent investment was in NESTEC in February. Find out more information here: https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20260226410979/en/Angeleno-Group-Announces-Investment-in-NESTEC-A-Leading-Industrial-Air-Pollution-Control-Platform
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Resources Mentioned:
Bloomberg New Energy Finance (NEF): https://about.bnef.com/?utm_source=google&utm_medium=paid_search&utm_campaign=amer_bnef_bssscorp_2025_ao&utm_content=text_bnef-amer-brand-hp&tactic=955953&gclsrc=aw.ds&gad_source=1&gad_campaignid=22172410789&gbraid=0AAAAADdH1c-jEC8vXBFpCCkXX8yAFNb9a&gclid=CjwKCAjwvqjOBhAGEiwAngeQnY7nXVgd1mWxgsoHUwNHY2Hrx83tJLdczCgFltazhsV7UacizAen4xoCx88QAvD_BwE
Ember: https://ember-energy.org/
Carbon Tracker: https://carbontracker.org/
World Resources Institute: https://www.wri.org/insights/rebranding-climate-action?utm_source=google&utm_medium=paid-search-google-grants&utm_campaign=climate-messaging-problem&gad_source=1&gad_campaignid=23209833113&gbraid=0AAAAAD3bc5vY8RS5Ywzkg8wQLlR6TtnFY&gclid=CjwKCAjwvqjOBhAGEiwAngeQnWHKVc8ebdFNb3ZysxhXU1jV1ajUHtXYzFEcgOHUv47sshZI2ZOFqRoCdq0QAvD_BwE
Solvable - Book by Susan Solovan https://share.google/ybfINxWip4pqNJHNd
The New Global Possible: Rebuilding Optimism in the Age of Climate Crisis - Book by Ani Dasgupta https://share.google/DWYOwPbI0nSllOjGu
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General Timestamps:
00:00 Introduction & Angeleno Group Overview
03:15 Founding Angeleno in 2001: Identifying the White Space in Energy VC
08:10 The Primary Driver of Change: Clean Energy Economics 1
1:20 Investment Landscape Then vs. Now: Investable Universe & Capital Flows
14:45 Firm Structure, AUM, and LP Base
17:00 Investment Thesis: Technology, Policy, and Industrial Expertise
21:00 Focus Areas and Portfolio Construction Across Climate Subsectors
24:00 Portfolio Company Examples: Grid Resilience and Renewable Procurement Software
28:30 AI, Data Centers, and the Long-Run Energy Demand Equation
36:00 The $250 Trillion Gap: Misperceptions and the Institutional Capital Challenge
44:00 Public Market Returns and the Case for Whole-Portfolio Alignment
47:00 Mission-Aligned Endowment Stewardship: WRI and California Community Foundation
51:00 Rapid Fire: Advice for Institutional Investors, Recommended Resources, and Career Guidance
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The Future of Finance podcast is produced by the Intentional Endowments Network, serving institutional investors working to align capital with long-term financial and systemic goals.

When You Own the Whole Market, You Can't Diversify Away From This | Systemic Climate Risk and Fiduciary Duty

What does fiduciary duty actually require when you own the whole economy? Madison Condon, Associate Professor at Boston University School of Law and recipient of the American Law Institute's Early Career Scholars Medal, brings one of the most rigorous legal and economic frameworks in climate finance to the Future of Finance podcast.
For institutional investors, pension funds, endowments, and sovereign wealth funds, climate change is not a values question. It is a portfolio-level structural exposure. When damages from fossil fuel companies cascade through every other holding in a diversified portfolio, the conventional logic of ESG as a screened strategy breaks down. What replaces it is a systems-level argument grounded in fiduciary law, macroeconomic modeling, and the economics of universal ownership.
Topics covered in this episode:
The legal basis for climate action under fiduciary duty, including the Uniform Prudent Investor Act and the duty of impartiality toward future beneficiaries
Why leading macroeconomic climate models have systematically underestimated damages and what better modeling looks like
The diverging interests of asset owners and asset managers, and why that distinction is increasingly consequential
The McRitchie v. Zuckerberg decision and what Delaware corporate law says about externalities and diversified shareholders
The Texas v. BlackRock antitrust case and the emerging legal risk landscape for climate-aligned investor coalitions
The role of IEA scenarios and institutions like NCAR in shaping capital allocation and why their integrity matters to investors
Future of Finance is produced by the Intentional Endowments Network. New episodes explore how institutional capital can be aligned with long-term economic resilience.
Resources Mentioned:
https://share.google/QGtJ3a2aIQpfIR7SM
General Timestamps:
00:00 Introduction — Universal Ownership and Systemic Climate Risk
03:15 The 2020 Paper: Externalities and the Common Owner
07:10 Asset Owners vs. Asset Managers — Why the Distinction Matters
10:20 Fiduciary Duty and the Legal Landscape for Climate Action
13:30 The Duty of Impartiality and Future Beneficiaries
16:40 Corporate vs. Portfolio Fiduciary Duties — The Delaware Question
23:10 Why Climate Economic Models Have Underpriced Risk
28:30 Supply Chain Bottlenecks and Place-Based Climate Impacts
32:50 Antitrust Risk and the Texas v. BlackRock Case
38:20 Investor Policy Engagement and the Role of Climate Data Institutions
43:00 IEA Scenarios as a Self-Fulfilling Mechanism in Capital Markets
47:30 Vision for the Future — Asset Owner Governance and Long-Term Capital

From Shareholder Primacy to Management Primacy: What's at Stake for Capital Markets

Fran Seegull, President of the U.S. Impact Investing Alliance, joins host Georges Dyer for a wide-ranging conversation on the structural forces reshaping institutional investing. Before leading the Alliance, which she co-founded with Darren Walker of the Ford Foundation, Fran served as Chief Investment Officer of ImpactAssets, overseeing its $3 billion impact investing donor-advised fund, and taught graduate-level impact investing at USC's Marshall School of Business.
For institutional investors, this conversation arrives at a critical juncture. The policy and governance environment is actively constraining the tools investors need to manage systemic risk: from anti-ESG legislation restricting fiduciary discretion, to executive actions targeting community finance infrastructure, to the erosion of shareholder engagement rights. At the same time, frameworks like system-level investing and dynamic materiality are gaining traction as rigorous, financially-grounded responses to risks that traditional portfolio theory was not built to handle.
 
Topics covered in this episode:
The U.S. Impact Investing Alliance: mission, structure, and four-pillar strategy
System-level investing as a bridge between traditional finance and impact frameworks
Capital markets assumptions and how systemic factors should be priced
Double materiality and dynamic materiality (definitions, distinctions, and investment implications)
The Community Reinvestment Act and CDFI ecosystem: importance, recent threats, and bipartisan defense
Anti-ESG legislation: the financial case against it and the first major constitutional challenge
The rise of corporate management primacy and the erosion of shareholder accountability tools
Impact measurement frameworks, verification tools, and the IEN Endowment Impact Benchmark
Final takes: what every institutional investor should do today, and Fran's vision for the future of finance
Essential listening for CIOs, pension trustees, endowment leaders, and policy professionals navigating the evolving intersection of fiduciary duty, systemic risk, and long-term capital markets stability.
 
Resources Mentioned:
Beyond Modern Portfolio Theory - https://share.google/0HU0Sfshhzw9ANysL
Principles Responsible Investing Podcast - https://www.unpri.org/newsroom/podcasts
 
General Timestamps:
00:00 Introduction & Guest Background
02:00 What the U.S. Impact Investing Alliance Does — and How It Came to Be
07:30 Global Context: Where the U.S. Stands in the Impact Investing World
09:00 Is Impact Investing Fit for Purpose? The Case for System Transformation
17:00 System-Level Investing: Non-Diversifiable Risk and the Full Toolkit
22:00 Capital Markets Assumptions, Double Materiality, and Dynamic Materiality
29:30 Community Investing: The CRA, CDFIs, and the Defense of Financial Infrastructure
41:30 The Freedom to Invest: Anti-ESG Legislation and the First Constitutional Win
47:30 Climate Policy Rollback: Market Forces vs. Federal Headwinds
50:00 Impact Measurement: From Transparency to Accountability
54:00 The Rise of Corporate Management Primacy — A New Governance Risk
1:00:00 Final Takes: One Action for Every Institutional Investor

Systemic Risk and Investor Engagement on Policy with Richard Roberts

Systemic climate risk is increasingly recognized across capital markets but how should institutional investors engage with the policy drivers shaping that risk?
In this episode of the Future of Finance podcast, host Georges Dyer speaks with Richard Roberts, Inquiry Lead at Volans, about the intersection of systemic risk, fiduciary duty, and investor engagement on real-economy climate policy.
For long-horizon asset owners, disclosure frameworks alone may not address the structural economic forces influencing portfolio outcomes. Energy systems, infrastructure policy, industrial strategy, and trade dynamics ultimately determine emissions pathways and market stability.
Key themes include:
The imbalance between disclosure-focused engagement and real-economy policy
Systemic risk across diversified portfolios
Catastrophic risk and the limits of economic modeling
Coalition-based approaches to policy engagement
Governance structures and long-term stewardship incentives
For CIOs, trustees, and policy leaders, the conversation explores whether policy engagement is becoming a necessary dimension of systemic stewardship.
Resources Mentioned:
Recalibrating Carbon Risk: https://carbontracker.org/reports/recalibrating-climate-risk/
Triple Bottom Line Harvard Business Review: https://hbr.org/2018/06/25-years-ago-i-coined-the-phrase-triple-bottom-line-heres-why-im-giving-up-on-it
Existential Politics - Jessica F. Green: https://share.google/RLMhxwaxpSnWvhqAj
Timestamps:
00:00 Introduction
03:10 Disclosure vs. Real-Economy Policy
08:00 Investor Resource Allocation Findings
14:20 Political Legitimacy and Engagement Constraints
19:40 Coalition Strategies and Collective Action
26:35 Fiduciary Duty and Systemic Risk
32:10 Catastrophic Risk and Tipping Points
47:45 A Long-Term Vision for Finance

Climate Risk, Carbon Pricing, and the Role of Investors

Climate change is not only an environmental issue but a capital markets risk management challenge.
In this episode of the Future of Finance podcast, Georges Dyer speaks with Bob Litterman, former Partner and Head of Risk Management at Goldman Sachs and Chair of the CFTC Climate-Related Market Risk Subcommittee. Bob shares why climate change should be understood through the lens of systemic risk, incentives, and pricing distortions.
This conversation examines what climate risk means for institutional investors, sovereign competitiveness, and long-duration capital allocation.
Key themes include:
Physical vs. transition risk from a portfolio perspective
Why carbon pricing corrects a structural market failure
The role of carbon border adjustment mechanisms
Global fossil fuel subsidies and capital misallocation
Financial regulatory frameworks for climate risk
The evolution of carbon accounting and compliance markets
For CIOs, trustees, asset managers, and policy leaders, this discussion explores how incentive structures shape capital flows and how markets may reprice climate risk faster than expected.
00:00 Introduction and Background
02:47 Climate Risk as a Risk Management Problem
05:41 Physical vs. Transition Risk
09:52 Why Carbon Pricing Is Foundational
14:22 Political Economy of Carbon Taxes
18:17 Investment Gaps in the Low-Carbon Transition
21:30 Carbon Accounting and Embedded Emissions
27:58 CFTC Climate Risk Report and Financial System Implications
35:04 Extreme Weather and Financial Stability
50:51 Vision for the Future of Finance
 
Resources Bob mentions:MANAGING CLIMATE RISK IN THE U.S. FINANCIAL SYSTEM | Report of the Climate-Related Market Risk Subcommittee, Market Risk Advisory Committee of the U.S. Commodity Futures Trading Commission
REPORT TO THE PRESIDENT Extreme Weather Risk in a Changing Climate: Enhancing prediction and protecting communities

The Evolution of Fiduciary Duty in the 21st Century | Caroline Flammer

What role should investors play in addressing systemic risks like climate change, inequality, and biodiversity loss?
In this episode of the Future of Finance podcast, we speak with Caroline Flammer, Director of the Sustainable Investing Research Initiative (SIRI) at Columbia University, about system-level investing, fiduciary duty, and the limits of modern portfolio theory.
What we cover:
Why systemic risks should be treated as endogenous, not exogenous
The evolving interpretation of fiduciary duty
How government inaction shifts responsibility to investors
The role of blended finance in emerging markets
Why risk perception may be limiting capital flows
🎧 Available on YouTube and all major podcast platforms: https://pod.link/1793610181
Links to resources Caroline mentioned:
Scaling Sustainable Investing in Emerging and Developing Economies: Frictions and Opportunities: https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=6088507
The Moskowitz Prize paper: https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=4770779
SIRI’s Blended Finance program: https://siri.sipa.columbia.edu/content/blended-finance
SIRI’s Pathways to Consensus program: https://siri.sipa.columbia.edu/content/pathways-consensus
#systemlevelinvesting #sustainableinvestingresearch #blendedfinance #emergingmarkets #columbiauniversity #impactinvesting #finance #climaterisk #endogenous #futureoffinance #futureoffinancepodcast

What Finance Gets Wrong About Success, Happiness & Legacy | Jenna Nicholas

Modern finance typically optimizes profit, but not human well-being. Investor and author Jenna Nicholas explains why that’s a problem, and how we can fix it.
In this episode of The Future of Finance Podcast, George Dyer sits down with Jenna Nicholas, President of LightPost Capital and author of Enlightened Bottom Line.
They explore:
Why GDP and profit fail to measure human flourishing
How spirituality, purpose, and finance intersect
The HEAL framework: Hope, Empathy, Abundance, and Legacy
Why money is “stored energy” that must circulate
How responsible AI could reshape investing
What today’s students and young professionals need to know about the future of finance
This conversation challenges the idea that maximizing returns alone leads to better outcomes, and offers a more human, long-term vision for capitalism, investing, and leadership.
🎧 Watch on YouTube: https://youtu.be/07v2WO5fTdE
📘 Enlightened Bottom Line by Jenna Nicholas: https://www.jenna-nicholas.com/book
Keywords: spirituality, impact investing, HEAL framework, Baha'i faith, sustainability, abundance, empathy, legacy, conscious capitalism, financial equity

Bending the Arc of the Digital Revolution: The Investor Guide to AI | Mike Kubzansky

In this episode of Future of Finance, Georges Dyer speaks with Mike Kubzansky, CEO of Omidyar Network, about how investors can actively engage with AI risks and opportunities to ensure technology serves broad societal benefit rather than concentrating power and prosperity among a few.
Kubzansky explains how Omidyar Network—founded over 20 years ago by eBay's Pierre Omidyar—uses investments, grants, and advocacy to "bend the arc of the digital revolution" toward broadly shared prosperity. With nearly three-quarters of a billion dollars deployed across early-stage startups, funds, and policy work, the organization focuses on building intentional governance structures around emerging technologies, much like society learned to regulate automobiles and biomedicine.
The conversation centers on practical strategies for investors looking to address AI-related risks in their portfolios. Kubzansky shares concrete guidance on how to work with external managers and portfolio companies to build trust, reduce harm, and create accountability around AI deployment. He emphasizes that technology doesn't govern itself—deliberate societal choices are required to capture benefits while minimizing risks.
Kubzansky also offers career advice for impact-oriented professionals, encouraging them not to bypass traditional finance roles at institutions like Goldman Sachs or CalPERS. Building core technical skills first, he argues, creates more effective impact practitioners later—as long as they maintain their moral compass and view these roles as developmental stops rather than final destinations.
Ultimately, the episode underscores how investors at every level can play a critical role in shaping responsible AI development through thoughtful engagement, governance, and strategic capital allocation.
 
Podcast: Odd Lots https://www.bloomberg.com/oddlots Podcast: Tech Policy Press https://www.techpolicy.press/podcast/ Substack: Garrison Lovely https://substack.com/@garrisonlovely Substack: Jasmine Sun https://substack.com/@jasmine 
Book: Power and Progress, by Acemoglu and Johnson https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/62315566-power-and-progress?ref=nav_sb_ss_1_27 Book: Carlota Perez: Technological Revolutions and Financial Capital https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/60509.Technological_Revolutions_and_Financial_Capital 
RailPen’s principles: https://www.railpen.com/news/2025/railpen-launches-new-framework-to-help-investors-and-companies-effectively-oversee-ai-related-risks/Edelman Trust Barometer: https://www.edelman.com/trust/2025/trust-barometer/flash-poll-trust-artifical-intelligence AIAT Report on the market and market size for AI Assurance Tech:  https://www.aiat.report/ 
Keywords: Responsible AI, AI governance, Tech policy, Digital revolution, Impact investing, Philanthropy, ESG investing, Technology regulation, Societal governance, Shared prosperity

From Venture Capital to Values: Building AI That Survives, Scales, and Serves Society

In this episode of Future of Finance, Georges Dyer is joined by Gaurab Bansal, Executive Director of Responsible Innovation Labs (RIL), to explore how startups and investors can embed responsible AI practices early—before harmful externalities become costly and difficult to unwind.
Bansal shares how RIL works with early-stage founders to integrate governance, risk awareness, and values into company culture while still prioritizing survival, growth, and commercial success. Rather than treating responsibility as a compliance exercise, he argues that responsible innovation is fundamentally a business strategy—one that leads to better products, stronger trust with customers, and improved long-term performance.
The conversation spans key AI-driven risks and opportunities, including workforce disruption, energy and climate impacts, misinformation, and social cohesion. Bansal also discusses the critical role investors—especially LPs and GPs—can play by incorporating downside risk and responsibility considerations into diligence, governance, and engagement with portfolio companies.
Ultimately, the episode highlights why the greatest leverage point for shaping the future of AI may lie with startups and early-stage capital—and how building good habits, governance, and decision-making frameworks from day one can help ensure technology advances human flourishing rather than undermining it.
This episode was brought to you by Metis Global Partners.
Keywords:
Responsible AI, Responsible Innovation Labs, Startup governance, Venture capital engagement, AI risk management, Workforce disruption, Technology externalities, Sustainable investing, LP–GP stewardship, Human-centered technology

Universal Ownership, Climate Risk, and the Future of Fiduciary Duty

In this episode of The Future of Finance, Georges Dyer is joined by Lucas Schoeppner, Director of Sustainable Investment Strategies at Westpath Benefits and Investments, to explore how a large faith-based asset owner is operationalizing fiduciary duty through system-level investing.
Westpath, the primary benefits and investment agency for the United Methodist Church, manages more than $26 billion on behalf of over 100,000 clergy and employees. Lucas walks through Westpath’s integrated approach to sustainable investing—grounded in social cohesion, long-term prosperity, and environmental health—and explains why these priorities are not only values-driven, but fundamental to long-term investment performance.
The conversation spans climate risk, human rights, biodiversity, and affordable housing, highlighting how Westpath uses a full toolkit that includes divestment, shareholder engagement, positive impact lending, and manager oversight. Lucas also discusses Westpath’s role as a universal owner, its participation in initiatives like Climate Action 100+ and the Net Zero Asset Owner Alliance, and how system-level risks are being embedded into investment policy and manager evaluation.
Throughout the discussion, Lucas emphasizes the importance of asking better questions—of companies, asset managers, and the financial system itself—to move beyond disclosure toward real-world impact. In a shifting political landscape, this episode offers a grounded case study in how fiduciary duty, long-term thinking, and sustainable investing can—and must—work together. 
This episode was brought to you by Metis Global Partners.
Keywords: System-level investing, Fiduciary duty, Universal ownership, Sustainable investing, Shareholder engagement, Net Zero Asset Owner Alliance, Climate Action 100+, Faith-based asset owners, Human rights risk, Long-term value creation